Vida The Podcast
Welcome to the Vida podcast with your hosts Rebecca Espinoza & Shay Frago! Vida gives a voice to the voiceless. We’re giving you a taste of conversations and perspectives meant to expand your mind, open your heart, and ignite your soul. As multicultural women, we believe that everyone deserves equal access to information and resources that can elevate your experience as a human being. We have honest conversations with each other along with diverse leaders, teachers, healers, and creatives from all walks of life to discuss topics ranging from relationships, business, spirituality, and so much more. Regardless of your cultural background, socioeconomic status, or childhood upbringing, there’s a space and a voice for you here. Thanks for joining us we as navigate this vida together!
Vida The Podcast
68. Wtf Does it Mean to Be an Adult and Do You Ever Truly Feel Like One?
In this episode, your favorite duo explores the themes of adulthood and how they've redefined the experience of being adults. Through their candid heart-centered conversation, they reflect on their evolving perception of the meaning of adulthood and how that's transformed from childhood, to adolescence, and to now. Rebecca and Shay tap into their favorite parts about adulthood and the unexpected learnings they've received in this life of "adulting". They answer the question of "wtf does it even mean to be an adult?". Ultimately, they express how this journey is ever-evolving and adulthood is about going out and experiencing the world and embracing change along the way. The journey never ends, babyyy (until it does!).
Key Moments
- Maturity, not age, defines true adulthood.
- Life experiences shape our understanding of adulthood.
- Independence is important, but so is seeking support from others.
- The journey of adulthood is filled with uncertainties and questions.
- Keep the childlike wonder in adulthood and find joy in life.
- Losing friends as an adult.
- The concept of 'forever' in relationships is often unrealistic.
- Freedom is an internal state, not just an external circumstance.
- Adulthood is filled with adventure and fun.
- It's important to celebrate personal achievements and growth.
- Intimacy in relationships deepens with age and experience.
- Change is a constant in adulthood, and embracing it is crucial.
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Rebecca Espinoza (00:00.735)
Hello everyone, welcome back to another episode of Vida.
Sorry, it says that I'm live streaming, am I? I don't think so.
Shay Frago (00:14.433)
I so.
Rebecca Espinoza (00:17.173)
Okay. Okay. Hello everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Viva. We came up with this episode topic on the fly and I'm actually, I think it's going to be a silly one to talk about, but also I think it's going to, it's going to go kind of deep just because of everything we've been going through, naturally finding the levity in life because we have to. How else are you going to get through it? I just had a really intense moment recently, so.
Definitely trying to find more levity. But before we get into the deep dive of this episode, start off with our usual little ritual, Shay como esta tu corazon.
Shay Frago (00:58.958)
I guess relaxed. I just got back from the studio and yoga not too long ago and that was nice. It's been a very full morning already but like I feel like yoga kind of felt very meditative and they needed that before needing to record so it was just like relaxed today.
Rebecca Espinoza (01:17.215)
How has it been a full morning already? It's Saturday. did you go teach?
Shay Frago (01:21.046)
I had to teach this morning. Yes, I've been going since 630. It's been a full morning. Yeah, teaching and then we had our very first pop-up of the season for the studio and then I went yoga and then
Rebecca Espinoza (01:25.053)
Okay, yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (01:29.319)
No, they are.
Rebecca Espinoza (01:34.538)
Mmm.
Rebecca Espinoza (01:38.899)
Okay, that's a full morning. That's a Shay-style Saturday morning.
Shay Frago (01:40.854)
Yeah. Yeah. How about you?
Rebecca Espinoza (01:49.557)
I'm, I feel like I'm on a come down, which is good. I feel like I'm finding equilibrium. I had a really intense two days ago experience just with like family dynamics that is just energy and experiences that are, you know, remnants.
from the passing of my dad and just like, you know, conversations that are still being had and my own existential pieces that are coming together and just like really, I don't know, the difficulties of being, learning to be in my family right now without my dad and learning to relate to each other because we're not really a family that really relates to each other. And I'm definitely coming up against some big challenges and initiations.
trying to discern what is my desire to run away and what is a decision that is actually meant for my expansion. And also trying to remind myself that there's no wrong path that I'm gonna choose because there will always be medicine in it. And at the end of the day, I'll be directed where I'm meant to go.
Yeah, for my highest timeline. So yeah, I feel like I'm definitely back on an equilibrium and did my TBM stuff and I was like super triggered and did a lot of move moving of my body, did a lot of crying and did some Pilates today, which felt really fucking nice. Like I haven't been to Pilates in a while because I've been way too immersed in the gym girl, the gym girl world.
Shay Frago (03:40.664)
you
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (03:45.021)
So it just felt so good to do Pilates and I feel like that type of workout is way more feminine in my opinion. But it's also really challenging still. So I felt the challenge in my body today, even though I've been killing it at the gym. I felt the challenge. Yeah, it's so different because there are different muscles that are being worked out and those muscles, the smaller muscles, which are foundational for the bigger ones, they hadn't been worked out in a while. So I was like, ooh, when I was moving,
Shay Frago (04:01.239)
It's different.
Rebecca Espinoza (04:15.337)
the chair. was like, okay, this is, this is my body hasn't felt this in a while.
Shay Frago (04:21.61)
I know, it's a good compliment, it'll feel great. I know I am.
two and a half pounds. Which I want to gain weight guys. I'm one of those people. Yeah, I was like, okay, sweet, the gym works.
Rebecca Espinoza (04:30.717)
I know that's the yeah exactly same same.
Rebecca Espinoza (04:40.671)
Same. Yeah.
Okay, yeah, you cut out a bit.
Shay Frago (04:46.35)
I keep saying the internet is unstable, but I swear it's just freaking computer.
Rebecca Espinoza (04:54.525)
Yeah, you're going in and out.
Shay Frago (04:57.678)
okay. Do you want to stop recording this and I'll just do it on my phone like I did last time. Was it okay on my phone?
Rebecca Espinoza (05:03.621)
Yeah, you can, ow. Yeah, it was good on your phone. So you can, I think that would be better.
Shay Frago (05:08.782)
Okay, because then I don't want us to lose something. I don't know what it is with this computer. It goes in and out with the internet, even though the internet's fine.
Rebecca Espinoza (05:20.789)
That's weird. Yeah, you can hop. I'll keep it running and you can just hop on because we can I can edit this part out.
Shay Frago (05:33.678)
Do I have to, cause if I leave, it like the stuff that was recorded.
Rebecca Espinoza (05:39.377)
No, it will upload. It will. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Shay Frago (05:42.762)
It did upload fine. Okay, okay, I'll be right back then.
Shay Frago (06:53.643)
Test, test, test. Can you hear me okay? Okay.
Alright, I maybe we're just gonna have to record like this for now.
Rebecca Espinoza (07:02.345)
Yeah, mean it works.
Shay Frago (07:03.807)
Yeah, mean, yeah, as long as the quality is good. I have a microphone just isn't really normal podcast setup, but whatever.
Rebecca Espinoza (07:13.192)
Okay.
All right, yeah, mean, gym girl life and Pilates girl's life has been a good balance for us. Yeah, we definitely talk about that all the time in our voice notes and our texts, but.
Shay Frago (07:29.085)
It is the only thing I'm really focused on right now.
Rebecca Espinoza (07:32.445)
It's a lifestyle too, we're just like counting our calories and just like, in a good way too, in a good way. feel like that's something that I had to actually, I talked to Erin about this, like I had to work through some, I guess, blocks that I was having around being meticulous around counting my calories and the food I was eating and like the fat that I was intaking and also like,
Shay Frago (07:36.18)
Yeah, that part.
Rebecca Espinoza (08:02.261)
looking at my body more like looking and being like, okay, is my butt game my butt getting more plump like is it getting to where I want and taking those transformation photos. I've never done that before and had to work through this programming around it being superficial and did you have any of that come up for you?
Shay Frago (08:17.782)
Okay, yeah. That no.
I think I was more like, I was coming up against pieces of me that I started to feel lazy, which is not like me. Like I'm someone who very much doesn't mind doing the work, but when it came to having to track my calories, like my inner achieve, like my overachiever and inner perfectness was coming out. like, I've been doing fitness forever and I've been teaching. I've just never needed to track my calories and my macros and stuff. And I had no problem hitting protein. That was very easy, but like the carbs,
Rebecca Espinoza (08:52.404)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (08:53.816)
Actually carbs is harder for me to hit for a person. And I just like would get frustrated because the first like couple of weeks of counting how much I was like eating every day and needing to do I was like this is annoying. And I just felt like I was doing everything wrong or I was like not hitting my numbers for the and I was just very very frustrated with that and then I was very very frustrated with my body because it was just like I'm not doing it so that I'm not giving myself
Rebecca Espinoza (08:55.743)
Me too.
Rebecca Espinoza (09:20.016)
Shay Frago (09:22.929)
the body that I need and just like getting down on myself. So feel like I had to work through those things more than anything. And then I had to like be gentle and remind myself like everything new in life, if there's a learning curve, it's time and also like be gentle with our body. Like I'm doing this, don't want to be mad at her for not being able to eat literally like 700 more calories a day. So it's not, I'm like, my God.
Rebecca Espinoza (09:28.895)
Mm-hmm.
Rebecca Espinoza (09:37.641)
Mm-hmm.
I know.
Rebecca Espinoza (09:48.327)
I know, that's a big one. And it's not supposed to be a big jump. You're not supposed to be going from eating 1,000 calories to eating 2,000 in like three days, you know? Like, cause then that's, know, I know, yeah, I get that. And it's a big personal development journey when you start going on the physical development journey with your body, because yeah, you need patience and kindness and gentle.
Shay Frago (09:59.879)
But my introduction is.
Rebecca Espinoza (10:15.977)
Like you need TLC for your body going through this because she's working really hard. We're working fucking hard in the gym. know, so yeah, that's been it's been quite a quite an illuminating journey. It's been really cool that we're all kind of in it right now, like all of our friends were just in this world right now. We're like gymming and when we're on a group vacations, we're just like, all right, got to get our protein. How much we're counting our calories. I got to eat our cottage cheese.
Shay Frago (10:19.85)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (10:38.236)
I don't know why we suddenly all became obsessed with our macros at the same time, but I love it.
Rebecca Espinoza (10:46.271)
That's really funny. All right. That's part of adult life. didn't expect. But getting into this conversation. Yeah. I mean, we came up with this. We decided to talk about this topic. We were on our business planning meeting this week and we're kind of just like, yeah, what are we going to free flow on? yeah, that's idea. I've had this. I had just a thought one time I was like,
Shay Frago (10:51.707)
you
Rebecca Espinoza (11:15.125)
Do I even feel like an adult? Like what the fuck does it even mean to be an adult? And am I ever actually gonna feel like one? Because sometimes I really do and sometimes I absolutely don't at all. Like recently this week, I did not fucking feel like an adult at all. I like a scared little girl. Yeah, which I think that part is always gonna be in us in some capacity. So let's get into that. Let's get into like adult life. Have you been feeling this lately?
questioning your own adulthood or just being like, what the fuck am I even doing? Do I know how to do adulthood?
Shay Frago (11:49.918)
Yes, I feel like my journey of adulthood has been more like, it doesn't need to be so serious. I was a parentified child, so like,
Rebecca Espinoza (12:02.675)
Yeah. Yeah.
Shay Frago (12:06.393)
13, 14, I had to be kind of like the parent figure for my younger siblings. So feel like I kind of stepped into an an adult. I put that in your quotations. So soon and I always kind of thought adulthood was like, I don't know, being responsible and hard and
Rebecca Espinoza (12:27.123)
Responsible, yeah.
Shay Frago (12:30.073)
I saw it literally as what the American dream is sold, which is like the white picket fence house. You're married at like 25, you have like kids and you work corporate America and you dress for that, you know? And that's what I assumed adulthood was. And it's definitely not that at all. I mean, for some people I'm sure it is, but that's definitely not my experience or perspective on it anymore. Which I feel like we can't.
and dive deeper into what we do, or we do, what was your perception of adulthood?
Rebecca Espinoza (13:00.137)
Hmm?
Rebecca Espinoza (13:06.803)
Yeah, my perception of adulthood was, actually I'm trying to think back when I was a kid and what I was witnessing and seeing. Honestly, it was just always doing. I think it was like you're always doing, you were always busy. Yeah, you had the kids, you had the marriage, you had the house. It's the same, that everything was figured out even though, and it was stressful. I think that's what I,
Shay Frago (13:20.107)
Mm-hmm.
Shay Frago (13:26.913)
and everything looks figured out.
Rebecca Espinoza (13:36.265)
picked up on as well. was like stressful and overwhelming, which, you know, not wrong today in some ways. Yeah, I don't think I ever saw like adulthood as fun when I was a kid. But once I became, I think, an adolescent, like in high school, it's that experience, that moment, you're just like, I can't wait to be an adult. I can't wait to be an adult because I then began to associate adulthood with freedom.
because I was like, I'm gonna move away to college. I'm gonna move out of my parents' house. I'm gonna be able to do whatever I want. So my perception on adulthood from a kid to being, guess, like a teenager and closer to being in my early 20s, it started to change. think I started to associate adulthood with freedom more than anything and not as much with responsibility. When I was in my late adolescence, I was like, I'm gonna be free, fuck yeah.
Shay Frago (14:06.198)
Right.
Shay Frago (14:26.551)
You
Shay Frago (14:35.658)
Yeah. I feel like that would be very common when you're in high school. Yeah, I think for me it was like, I'd have things figured out. That was always.
Rebecca Espinoza (14:35.957)
So that's been my journey.
Rebecca Espinoza (14:45.843)
Yeah, married by 23 and having a kid by 25. That was my perception at least. Like I'm gonna be married and have my first kid by 25.
Shay Frago (14:49.704)
Now what you doing? Yeah.
I thought that. I don't know why the fuck anyone thought 25. That was common. was in, with literally all my friends, everyone I ever talked to that are around late 20s to mid 30s all thought the same thing. Why the age 20? I don't know where that program came from. I think having it figured out as in the sense that I would never not have an answer. I would never not know something.
Rebecca Espinoza (15:00.125)
It was.
Rebecca Espinoza (15:22.037)
Hmmmm
Shay Frago (15:23.349)
The exact opposite of adulthood is kind of you're just always figuring it out. You don't ever really fully know. Like there are certain things that I think are tried and true and rinse and repeat system as an adult. Like, I guess money to some degree or like your job, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like there are systems, but when it comes to any major life decision, you're still left with a question mark. I don't, I don't know. do I figure this out? Like no matter the age, it
something that is a constant of I think being human, not necessarily adulthood, but that's how I associate it is that an adult would know all the answers and so any problem that went away, was like, I'm just gonna know the answer.
Rebecca Espinoza (16:06.805)
Yeah, exactly. And I just feel like, I don't know, I feel like the term adult is just so broad, like it's so fucking broad. And yeah, I think your adulthood is marked by different initiations and seasons and events of life. I feel like when I think about adulthood versus like,
a number I guess because it's really wild to me that at 18 we're considered adults.
Shay Frago (16:38.323)
No. You're a teenager. Yeah, it's like, no, 18, 19, like, teen.
Rebecca Espinoza (16:46.521)
Yeah, it's we're legally adults and you can send kids off to war. And what fucking for all this is this okay? Your prefrontal cortex is not even fully developed yet.
Shay Frago (16:52.455)
Yeah, which is.
Shay Frago (16:57.98)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (17:03.602)
No, I feel like adult is just a word. I mean, like many things in life.
Rebecca Espinoza (17:10.035)
It's like money. It's like what the meaning we give to it.
Shay Frago (17:11.922)
Yeah, and I think I would define it now. I would, I say maturity is actually more what matters because like age definitely doesn't really matter. Like there's definitely people who are younger and people are like, oh my God, you're so mature. You're like an adult. And I think it really comes down to the maturity and that
I think comes down to embodied wisdom, like what life lessons did you have to learn at what age and why that makes us the way we are. Because there's people who are adults that I've definitely met in their 40s or 50s and I'm like, you're like a teenager still. like your maturity, I think, would be a better definition in my opinion on like what defines adulthood.
Rebecca Espinoza (17:46.131)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (17:56.223)
Exactly.
Rebecca Espinoza (18:06.933)
Truly, truly I think adulthood is like your lived experiences. It's like what you said because.
I mean, I always think back to, it was so strange that I remember my ex, he told me his like, you know, when you start getting to know someone, you're opening up, telling your life story, blah, blah, blah. He told me that he felt like he just hadn't lived really life because, and mind you, he was like 18.
And he was like, just, I felt like nothing was happening. Nothing like I was like, they were, he came from like a well off family. Like he grew up in Barcelona and like he was mostly like nothing, no challenges and difficulties had really entered his life. And I give him credit for having this awareness until this day he is still probably one of the most intelligent.
people that I know and let's hope he never listens to this podcast. doubt he would because he doesn't use ego stroked. But yeah, he to have that level of awareness at 18 and be like, I haven't fucking experienced anything in life that is worth really maturing me. So what he did is he literally joined like I think this like Jane Goodall, mind you, his mom got him into this because being from a well-off family, like internship or something.
where he got shipped off to Africa and lived in Africa. then while he was there, he ended up working for this other organization. While he's 18, a white man, a kid living in Africa, and he was there for like a year and a half. And he learned the language, he immersed himself. And some of the stories that he told me, which I won't repeat because they're not my stories and he didn't even open up that much, I literally asked him, was like,
Shay Frago (19:39.508)
Thanks.
Shay Frago (19:55.586)
I don't care.
Rebecca Espinoza (20:06.559)
therapy for this because this is fucking crazy. Like the things that you experience at 18 going into 19 and that that I think that shaped him really like to obviously live his life the way he continued to live his life later on. But it's things like that, right? It's like you don't. The life that you live is going to shape the way you are as an adult. And it's like.
Shay Frago (20:21.23)
for sure.
Rebecca Espinoza (20:34.943)
being given, and some people, everyone has dealt different cards. Like for example, you were a parent of a child at a really young age, so you were forced to grow up and take care of people in your life before you even knew what it meant to take care of someone, to like take care of yourself. I also, I spent a lot of time by myself because my parents worked so much and I didn't have really a relationship with my brother, so.
Shay Frago (20:52.866)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (21:01.929)
That is gonna shape me and how I know how to be independent. And I got that always at a very young age. It's like, wow, you are really resourceful. You really know how to like pivot and you're really independent. It's like, yeah, I fucking had to know how to do that since I was a kid.
Shay Frago (21:16.74)
Yeah, you know and I think I don't I think Amazing if you get to grow up in a household where you don't need to be like you get files and
Rebecca Espinoza (21:29.319)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (21:29.933)
and like all of that, think that's awesome, like I know I want to give that to my kids, but I want to help them develop the skill sets that I had to learn the hard way. You have to learn things the hard way, absolutely not, and I will just say that I know people who also have lived very privileged upbringings and never needed to do anything.
Rebecca Espinoza (21:33.717)
Mm-hmm.
Rebecca Espinoza (21:38.357)
Absolutely.
Rebecca Espinoza (21:53.365)
People. I know who you're talking about.
Shay Frago (21:58.7)
And it like, it's really sad because like I'm like, I literally watch people who have no backbone to life. And it's like, I don't mean this in a belittling way. It's actually just like very sad because you're not resourceful. You're not very good at being independent. You're bailed out on a lot of things. You have no ability. You're unreliable.
Rebecca Espinoza (22:10.226)
I know.
Shay Frago (22:25.053)
And like, those are not great things. Like those are not great things. And like that's something you can develop, but it has to be something that you want to develop. Otherwise, yeah, it is super uncomfortable. And I feel like that's why.
Rebecca Espinoza (22:35.377)
Mm-hmm. It's very uncomfortable.
Rebecca Espinoza (22:41.397)
Because who's the one that wants to be comfortable inside of you, the archetype, it's usually the kid, right? It's like the kid is the one that needs the parent for like safety and attachment. And yes, the kid has curiosity. I think that's what guides a lot of us to be like, ooh, what's that path over there? But the kid always wants to return to its healthy attachment and be like, no, it's safe over here. Like, I don't wanna go out there by myself and like do this experience by myself.
Shay Frago (23:06.058)
Your parents are not always going to be here. And so if you're listening to this and you fall under that bucket, it's OK. And you have to grow because your parents are not always going
Rebecca Espinoza (23:09.961)
And it's, you know, the more mature, ripe archetype that is like, no, we're to go fuck and do this. We don't know how we're going to do it, but we're going to do it because we know we're going to learn along the way and we're going to get what we need to.
No!
Shay Frago (23:32.841)
either and what are you gonna do just marry someone who basically becomes your mom which I guess is probably what I'm fully aware of I've witnessed that out in the world it's actually quite common but I just like I don't know as someone who wants so much more in her life when I witness people like that or reflect on past people like ooh like that's not life but each their own and I guess that's adulthood
Rebecca Espinoza (23:37.225)
Well, no, that's what people do, yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (23:58.879)
Yeah.
And I think there is also, yeah, that is adulthood. I think there is also, I want to name this, like there is a balance between...
just knowing you can fully do it by yourself and be like, fucking got this and I'm gonna do it by myself. I don't give a fuck. I don't need anyone. I know how to take care of myself. I'm gonna figure it out. I'm so resourceful and to softening and surrendering into the support of other people because sometimes you do need it. And I think that is a big one I had to learn in adulthood. Also surprisingly was, and I know you can relate to this as well. You can't do it by yourself.
Shay Frago (24:29.64)
You
Shay Frago (24:42.6)
No.
Rebecca Espinoza (24:43.677)
and you're not meant to do it. It doesn't make you stronger if you just stride through all of the challenges by yourself, especially even if you're struggling and you're afraid to ask for help or you just are gonna be looked at as weak. I saw my dad do that for years, mostly in my childhood. He just was like, I know how to do it. I'm gonna do it. I'm, I know I'm the man of the house and I'm gonna figure it out, not asking for help and like not integrating my mom into.
certain, you know, decisions are being made because he's just like, I can do it, I can figure it out. And that is very taxing on the nervous system. And that's not gonna get you very far on this long game of human life, because ideally you wanna be here for a while. So that's a big lesson I had to learn, I think in adulthood too, is like actually asking for help.
Shay Frago (25:10.408)
Yeah, which I feel like really stems from
knowing yourself and having friendship with yourself, understanding yourself, communication, that I think we all get to develop. And I think in order to be able to ask for help, means like you're even up with you. That comes from so much programming, I suppose, of like,
Rebecca Espinoza (25:41.845)
Hmm.
Rebecca Espinoza (25:59.765)
Mm.
Shay Frago (26:07.596)
society and like what's instilled as us as men, like the collective, not just as individuals. Like there are definitely underlying threads that I feel I speak to, at least in the millennial generation that we all have in different ways that have come from like universal thoughts and idea, ideology of how we should be operating. Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (26:33.596)
Absolutely. Okay, what do you think was an unexpected piece for you about adulthood that you learned?
Shay Frago (26:43.382)
Hmm... Hmm... Losing friends.
Rebecca Espinoza (26:50.197)
Oh, sure, yeah.
Shay Frago (26:51.865)
I would say, same relationships and that things really are not forever. I feel like we are sold this concept at least in Disney Princess program. Like this foreverness, this idea of like even in love and it's like forever is not real. I mean that in the sense that like forever only happens if it's like
Rebecca Espinoza (26:59.125)
Hmm.
Shay Frago (27:20.781)
truly meant to happen and like two people are choosing and it doesn't matter whether it's family, it's platonic, it's romantic, it's all of it. And I just think like the older I got, like especially after college, like I went through such a heartbreaking period for a while there, like just losing my friends and realizing that I was a grown up patient and that I didn't resonate with certain people anymore.
Rebecca Espinoza (27:25.235)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (27:49.187)
certain people didn't resonate with me anymore. just like losing the group of friends that was my first sense of home and family, it's very important years of growing up. And I was like, no one ever prepares you for losing friends and how heartbreaking it is and how left out and lonely you can feel. And I feel like that one was very unexpected because I always kind of held this
Rebecca Espinoza (27:58.375)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (28:19.427)
perception that like my college friends were forever and other friends were forever. Eventually it got to a place where I was like, don't have friends anymore. Like I don't know how to make friends as an adult. Like that was also...
Rebecca Espinoza (28:33.717)
That's a big one too, that I think a lot of people are afraid to navigate as adults is making friends in a new season of your life as an adult. And yeah, think it was actually, yeah, I mean, I said this last time Brianna Weist, she said, if you're not losing people in your life, you're not growing unless they're growing at the same caliber and rate as you, which is possible. Like I think, yeah, I...
Shay Frago (28:59.689)
Okay.
Rebecca Espinoza (29:03.647)
think that's absolutely possible, but the people that you knew when you were in high school or the people that you knew when you were in college, the probability of you, again, your prefrontal cortex was not developed then. So the probability of you seeing friends through your whole life after that is probably really low. But I have seen it, but then I also question, I have heard it from people actually who are still friends with like friends from high school. They're like, I don't know. Like it just doesn't feel.
Shay Frago (29:27.665)
.
Rebecca Espinoza (29:32.681)
Like I vibe anymore, but like, who else am I gonna be friends with? And that's really sad because I think that just, that makes me sad because that goes to the Testament of like the scary little child who is like, I don't wanna leave my comfort zone, but then that's the responsibility of you as an adult to go now and show the little child like, no, we've got this. Like, look at what we've accomplished in life and move through life and we've gone through it. We can move through this new change.
of developing new friendships and it's going to be very uncomfortable, but I think it's worth it.
Shay Frago (30:08.679)
I too. just, would challenge people to reflect on their life because I think too often people don't like saying it. People do settle, like people settle.
And you're settling because you're not comfortable breaking out of it. And one of my favorite personal development quotes was always like, your prison. And if you think of people who are sentenced to life in prison, they just live in this cage this whole time and see the same walls and just outside those bars and they don't ever really fully get to experience life. And I think if you want to be on your deathbed one day, there's a book, I forget what it's called, but it's like,
common things that people have talked about like all the time. And the one of the number one things is like not living life enough. Like not living life enough, falling all in, not just like, yeah, just you want to think that if this was your last day on earth and you looked back on the days before this current moment, can you say that your life feels totally, totally fulfilling and like you'd feel complete with your human experience? And if your answer to that is no, then you're not fully living something.
Rebecca Espinoza (30:50.923)
f-
Shay Frago (31:18.623)
What is your favorite tips, travel experiences, and of course, like, I don't know, it could be anything.
Rebecca Espinoza (31:18.772)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (31:24.981)
I agree. Like, once death knocks on your door, what are you gonna do? Like, you're gonna have to accept the life that you lived. And I mean, I saw that happen with my dad and I also experienced it where I was like seeing death happen. And I was like, whoa, this could happen at any moment for me.
Am I going to be happy with my life? And that's yeah, that's a big motivation to continue living and surrounding yourself with the people you actually want to be around and who aren't draining your energy, who you can actually relate to. Yeah.
Shay Frago (31:59.568)
and being you, like being the person you are genuinely for.
Rebecca Espinoza (32:05.979)
Exactly. And that person evolves continuously. So it's like welcoming those parts that want to come forward during a certain season of your life. Yeah, I think when you said this relates to like what was unexpected for me when you said that prison. So there is this drawing. It's a very viral drawing that I'm sure you've seen on social media. But it's like this person behind bars.
but then the bars aren't actually surrounded by like a wall. So it looks like they're in a prison, but then literally they can just like walk outside and they think they're trapped and they're just behind these bars, but the exit is literally right there and they can just exit. So it's like you're making up your own personal prison and you can escape it yourself. You are the only thing standing in your way. And I think what was unexpected for me, what?
Shay Frago (32:44.422)
Mm.
Shay Frago (33:02.87)
that that reminds me of the fly experiment where it's like they put these fly jar and like this is literally how humans are they like they put all these flies in a jar and then they close the door and so the flies learn to just only hover and like go without the jar being open and then they open the jar for those flies to stay thick and fly out but they don't
Rebecca Espinoza (33:24.149)
Yeah, because they got conditioned and programmed and there's a variety of those kinds of experiments. They also did them with the dog. It's like, or was it a dog? It was some sort of animal, but like they get like lightly shocked in like a certain area and they have to like find the part that that's like safe.
Shay Frago (33:26.982)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (33:43.131)
they've got used to all of the areas being kind of like shocked. So once they get shocked, they literally just stay there and they're just sitting there getting shocked over and over. And it's like, there's actually a spot somewhere else. You just have to go find it and get out. It's so sad also like hate what we do to like animals sometimes to get these experiments and these results. But I think what was something that was unexpected for me was that going back to the concept of freedom,
Freedom is not something that it was like, guess an understanding for me that was unexpected is like freedom is not a place. You can't just go find freedom. You have to work through it internally. And like I said, when I was a teenager, I was like, I'm gonna be so free. I'm gonna be away from my parents. I'm gonna be living by myself and I'm gonna be experiencing a whole new life.
Shay Frago (34:13.754)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (34:38.695)
I was free to an extent, but I was going through so much shit. Like I was crossing borderline depression throughout college. And then once I graduated college, I became depressed and I was going through a lot of insecurities in my relationship. And that made me feel trapped inside. I didn't know it at the time, but I felt so trapped and so insecure. So freedom is what I, what I learned as an adult. I was unexpected is if you want freedom.
you have to start with your internal world. It's not gonna be out there in the external. And that's something that I'm still working on every single day. Because I keep saying like, yeah, freedom is pillar of mine. It's important. And I still have to remind myself that like, okay, just because I'm making X amount of money, I'm gonna have this amount of freedom, yes and no, that'll only give you partial freedom. And that is something that I've continued, had to continue to.
Shay Frago (35:27.713)
Yeah, for sure.
Rebecca Espinoza (35:36.895)
Just work on, yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (35:43.513)
Okay, well, I mean, that's like the really deep stuff, guess. But, I mean, favorite part about being an adult, I think there's so many.
Shay Frago (35:49.849)
I'm going to adventure. feel like at least at this place in my journey of being human and adult, I suppose, it's just so fun. Like I really think it is fun. Like when you get to a place where you like who you are, you like who you're becoming, you love who you've surrounded yourself with, you have
Hopefully a job that you don't hate, you don't necessarily hate it, doesn't suck the life out of you. I enjoy my job, it's not what I want to do forever, but I enjoy my job and I have room in my life for everything that brings me joy. And I think it's just, I have these moments where I'm like, life is just so fun. just think when you are that comfortable in your own skin and the life you're living, you reach that kind of level of freedom where you're just like, what?
Rebecca Espinoza (36:45.717)
Mm-hmm.
Shay Frago (36:46.987)
Like it's almost like every day becomes a blank canvas and like, do want to paint today? And it can be so fun to be in that energy and to meet those parts of yourself. And I just think like the adventure of where life takes you day to day, even like the deep parts, it's actually, it's fun. Like the duality of it is fun, even in the mess.
Rebecca Espinoza (37:10.335)
Yeah, I agree. feel like that's kind of mine too. It's just opportunity that is available as an adult that is clearly not available as like when you're young. And again, it's like each time you further down, you get into being adult, there's like more opportunity, different kinds of opportunities. Cause again, you've lived life and you're just like, what else you're seeing different perspective and you're like, what can I do with that? What can I create? Where can I go?
Shay Frago (37:20.379)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (37:39.359)
What kind of people can I meet? And I mean, yeah, it is fun. It is like playful too. And I think that's, mean, going back to the unexpected piece too, maybe is like, I know you said you were like, yeah, we both said it's like just being really responsible and you were like, it's about being serious. And I guess what was unexpected for me is also the...
being, bringing in your childlike wonder into your life, into adulthood and playing more. Like I still see the kids that I teach today and they're like, I can't wait to be an adult because they're being told what to do by adults. And they're just like, okay, so when I'm this age, then I'm gonna be able to do this. And I was like, yeah, but you're also gonna have to pay taxes. You're gonna have to like, everything that your mom does for you, you're gonna have to know how to do by yourself. And they just look at me like, and I'm like, yeah, exactly. So enjoy being a kid.
Shay Frago (38:09.704)
Yeah
Rebecca Espinoza (38:32.393)
Because you're actually going to need that part of you in some ways when you become an adult. Like you're going to want to access that. Like I did this inner child work recently that I with my therapist and I was like telling my inner child about all the things we've experienced and she was like exploding with like so much wonder because my whole thing is like I haven't done enough in life. I haven't done enough. I need to do more. I need to do more. I need to accomplish more. But like what I've told her what we've done and experience she was just like my
God, this is so cool. Like we did so much. And I think that's the kind of childlike wonder that is so needed in adulthood. Cause then you're just like serious. So it's like, yeah, going back to what you're saying, it's like joy, having the joy in life because there is endless opportunity, I think.
Shay Frago (39:21.084)
There 100 % is, yeah. I'm gonna butcher this quote so you guys can find the proper one. But I do remember reading something that I like, I have experienced this with one person I've dated, but I know that I can experience it again. And I feel like I definitely experienced it with my friends. It's just like, you want to find that person that like, you can grow old with, but like you're forever, like you become more and more childlike. Yeah, I was like,
Rebecca Espinoza (39:47.153)
Yes, yeah.
Shay Frago (39:50.353)
I love that, like you are technically becoming more adult according to timelines, but you're becoming more and more just like fun and free and adventure, that connection and that curiosity that kids have and it's just, it's awesome.
Rebecca Espinoza (40:05.875)
Yeah, I think you hear people say like very enlightened people are actually really childlike. Like it was that was said about like the Buddha and the Dalai Lama actually that was said about him that was just like because they're so enlightened and aware and they realize like don't fucking take this so seriously, man. Like so much more that they're just so and they're just so like, wow, this life is also simultaneously so beautiful and incredible looking at it through that lens.
Shay Frago (40:23.367)
Which is not.
Shay Frago (40:27.155)
Stay with
Rebecca Espinoza (40:36.029)
And I think that's moving through the densities of being human. Like you're kind of trying to transcend that just a little bit, not too much though. But I think another piece that I really love about being an adult is the level of intimacy you're able to experience.
Shay Frago (40:45.104)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (40:56.163)
Yes. Not everyone. Maybe not everyone because I feel like, again, it comes back to a lot of the things we talked about in so many other episodes is like that level of connection. I know we experience.
Rebecca Espinoza (40:57.703)
Yeah. What?
Rebecca Espinoza (41:10.805)
No, I know not everyone experiences, but you can. That's what I'm like. You can experience it. I think that is what's cool about being an adult because I think about when I was 16 and I was like, you know, dating or even having friendships. My friendships actually were like, were like really bonded when I was like in high school. But my romantic relationships. Oh my God. I literally get the ick sometimes when I think about like, I was like, wow, weird, like kids.
trying to be adults. Like when you're in these relationships, really, you're trying to be adults when you're like dating as a kid, you're just like, this is not healthy. This is probably not a good idea. Yeah, like honestly, but when you allow yourself to kind of deepen on this path of like awareness and intentional connection and relating, and that's to me, one of my pillars is connection and life and it's
Shay Frago (41:47.939)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (42:05.275)
it will always be and that doesn't always mean with people, but like connection to myself, connection to people, of course, connection to the earth, the world that I live in, just like being connected because that means you're open and available to like receive and to also give. gosh, I just, man, when I think about the evolution of my relationships, I get so happy.
Shay Frago (42:10.659)
it.
Rebecca Espinoza (42:32.595)
And that's like all relationships. Like I get so happy because I'm like, fuck, I'm really lucky. And I'm lucky to have met people that are willing to reciprocate that as well. Like my relationships have only gotten better and better as I've gotten older, including my romantic relationships to the, yeah, that I'm like, damn, that's actually a really cool part about being an adult.
Shay Frago (42:39.963)
I agree.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, because I feel like I don't know, I guess I my viewpoint of relationships when I was younger was not great, like, marriage, you lose friends like the narrative.
Rebecca Espinoza (43:10.761)
Yeah.
Shay Frago (43:19.789)
And I was just like, no, you don't lose friends. Like I was in denial about that. Or like you don't have friends rather. you just don't have time. And like you just have to work all the time and be responsible. Like it just seemed like adulthood kind of.
Rebecca Espinoza (43:26.069)
Mm.
Shay Frago (43:34.317)
I don't know why wanted to be one, but the narrative, if I think of it, that's like true. Like it just seemed lonely. And I would say I definitely, I mean, sure, I have human moments where I'm lonely, blah, blah, blah, but I don't. Like I have so much depth. Like my word, I think you said your word was connection. One of my words with my authentic code, the fear was roots. And when I think of roots, they're going deep in the earth.
Rebecca Espinoza (43:36.797)
I go...
Shay Frago (44:03.861)
And that's how I see so many of my relationships. are my roots and rose from that. And it's like this foundation is really, really strong foundation. And I am very grateful for that because I've worked hard to have these types of relationships and it is very fulfilling. And I think, yeah, I was fed a narrative where relationships don't get to feel as good and change that script big time and
Rebecca Espinoza (44:09.077)
Hmm.
Rebecca Espinoza (44:20.917)
Mm-hmm.
Shay Frago (44:33.397)
I wish that for everyone to experience.
Rebecca Espinoza (44:36.169)
Yeah, I agree. And I think our world should be such a different, more safe and thriving world if people cared about their relationships more, cared about relating more and how they impact, we all impact each other, right?
Shay Frago (44:48.959)
This took.
Shay Frago (44:57.117)
Yeah, developing that skill set of intimacy and awareness.
Rebecca Espinoza (45:03.217)
the world would be a very different place, I think, and I don't know, very Atlantean or Lumarian, which still still thriving to get there. OK, what do you wish your younger self knew about adulthood?
Shay Frago (45:22.269)
I think that yeah, I it comes back to like, doesn't have to be that serious. Like don't take actually, I'm gonna go with the four agreements how he says like, definitely. Those to me kind of like, can be same thing. But this is like not taking anything too seriously, because I think like my natural personality type, take everything personal. Like, maybe not so much anymore. I've gone a lot better. But like for sure.
Rebecca Espinoza (45:22.643)
Wise words from Big Sis.
Rebecca Espinoza (45:46.397)
Me too.
Shay Frago (45:51.314)
I would say up until maybe five years ago, I took things very, very, very, very personally and I made it about myself. And it came from a very hurt, wounded version of myself and like ego a little bit. And really like, it's not that serious. Like I'd say almost 99 % of the time, something that someone does to you is often a reflection of them and has literally nothing to do with you. But it took me a long time to actually like,
believe that or witness that because I made things personal. And I think where I am now, like, yeah, like I wish I could have gone back and told myself like all those times that I needed or spent like, wasted energy on. It was just like, yeah, had I not taken it so serious, so personally, I would have just like freed myself a lot sooner. Because I just, think we all go through so many different things and how we
react and show up in the world usually comes from a defensive or reactionary place for most of us. It is very rare that I know people react in a specific way because they're intentionally trying to be that way. And yeah, I think if I had, yeah, I wish I had known that sooner.
Rebecca Espinoza (47:08.233)
Yeah, I think I'm gonna echo on that too, because I do tend to be someone that takes things personally or seriously. And yeah, I think it's just telling them that you're actually not gonna have it figured out, probably never. But that's okay, because you are gonna learn a lot. And as someone that really, even as a kid, really loved to learn, I want...
them to lean into that experience of like what catches their eye to want to be curious about to have that curiosity and go with it because that's actually going to get them that's going to get them really far is like not being afraid to continue to being curious and having enjoying it along the way because it's a really long path. So might as well fucking enjoy the walk the sprint.
Shay Frago (47:56.503)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (48:01.439)
the fucking jog, whatever it's gonna be down that really, really long path. And it's okay to take detours. I'm literally seeing like a fucking actual path of like a meadow and a forest and like, go take a detour. You'll be fine. Like life will, life will, what? Actually, yeah, stop and smell the roses. Stop and eat the mushrooms, not the poisonous ones, but the fun ones. Like it's okay.
Shay Frago (48:16.583)
Stop and smell the roses.
Shay Frago (48:30.043)
God, live, like truly live.
Rebecca Espinoza (48:33.693)
I know, and I think we're doing a pretty good job of it so far. like, I try to remind myself that too, where, I don't know, sometimes I get into the narrative of like, I'm being irresponsible because I don't have this yet, or I'm not like this person that's in my life and they're on this track and trajectory.
Yeah, honestly, I feel like I've lived life though and I'm like still living it. I'm really enjoying it. So I wouldn't have it any other way.
Shay Frago (49:04.581)
Yeah, I agree. I know I have some friends here who were just like, you're gonna end up living like in Europe or like, I don't know, they just have this big, elaborate, beautiful like life for me. was like, wow, would love if I lived my life like that. I was like, could I like? Yeah, was like, why I stay here? And they're like, I don't know, because you're just so free. And I was like, that is a compliment. Like my
Rebecca Espinoza (49:19.167)
You're like, thanks. Thanks for manifesting that for me. Okay.
Rebecca Espinoza (49:30.431)
huge compliment.
Shay Frago (49:31.545)
gives freedom, means that like I give, I give that to people that just remind you just like, really, when in my head, I don't think of myself. I feel like a part of adulthood is celebrating yourself more. don't slow down enough to celebrate how far I've come, like hardly ever, honestly. And I'm going to give that as another piece of advice to like,
Rebecca Espinoza (49:42.12)
I know.
Rebecca Espinoza (49:48.661)
Yeah, that's a big one, celebrating yourself.
Rebecca Espinoza (49:55.977)
Sam.
Rebecca Espinoza (49:59.445)
Hmm.
Shay Frago (50:01.657)
Slow down enough and celebrate yourself.
Rebecca Espinoza (50:03.797)
Honestly, I just I did that when I did my inner child thing. was like, oh, fuck. Yeah, you're right. We we've done we've done some pretty cool things and you're you don't realize it until you're you don't realize it ever. I don't think because we're always trying to go to the next thing because it's a very human desire is like, OK, what's next? What's next? And it's just like, just settle into it. Like, look around and be like, fuck, like, look, look, look at my life. And a lot of people will look at your life and and.
Shay Frago (50:17.497)
No.
Rebecca Espinoza (50:32.657)
celebrate you like you said so just do it for yourself.
Shay Frago (50:34.425)
Yeah. I know. It's so funny. I wish we could all see each other through each other.
Rebecca Espinoza (50:41.013)
I know that would be quite a psychedelic experience. Okay, so final line then, what the fuck is adulthood? Then if you had to simmer it down to one line.
Shay Frago (51:01.445)
Change.
Rebecca Espinoza (51:02.911)
Oof.
Alright, we're ending the episode there. That's what it is. It's so true!
Shay Frago (51:11.266)
It's yeah, it's just changed. It's like always changing or unknown like either way they're synonymous just Yeah, whichever feels more freeing to you like life is literally an adulting is literally always the unknown question mark or The opposite of that. It's kind of the same same is just like it's constantly changing like you're never really in the same place, hopefully not because if you're not growing you're dying is what one my mentors had told
So
Rebecca Espinoza (51:42.847)
That is a very abrasive reminder, but it's so real.
Shay Frago (51:47.319)
When you look at plants if they're not growing anymore then they're dying. So we don't want that. We want to live.
Rebecca Espinoza (51:53.429)
We don't want that. We don't. I guess humans are doing both, though, because we are growing and dying simultaneously. I think it kind of every day you're potentially closer to your death. You just don't know. We can. That's that's the whole existential thing. What is that? Honestly, it is it's change. That is change. Death is change. I come to realize that death is the biggest form of change and transformation that we could experience.
Shay Frago (52:08.896)
What is?
Rebecca Espinoza (52:22.261)
Because in my belief, you change and transform back to the essence of spirit. So to go from dense to light, essentially, or that's for me the biggest form of change and transformation a human being can experience. So not saying I'm welcoming it anytime soon, but that is what I've come to understand about death. OK, what the flight doesn't mean to be an adult. Let me see.
Shay Frago (52:35.226)
Yeah.
Rebecca Espinoza (52:54.653)
experience.
Shay Frago (52:55.168)
Yeah, I like that. All synonymous. Yeah, exactly. All right.
Rebecca Espinoza (52:57.523)
Yeah, that's you just you live and you experience that that's truly what it means for me to be an adult and yeah change at the same time. I think those two are they are like go experience your life go live and you go do that. You're actually going to be welcoming in a lot of change.
Rebecca Espinoza (53:18.623)
fun episode. This one was short and sweet, but it was a good one. Is there anything left on your heart that you want to share before we close off?
Shay Frago (53:25.088)
No, I feel good. I'm curious to know what y'all think once you hear this though, so definitely let us know.
Rebecca Espinoza (53:32.723)
Yeah, please tap in, leave us a comment on Spotify. You can do that. You can send us a text, I believe. So now through Buzzsprout. And we just wanna know what your thoughts on this topic are. If it resonates with you, please rate it, review it, or send it to a friend who may be going through a hard time in their life as an adult. And then hopefully this provides some ease and some comfort. So thank you again for being here and we'll see you next week.
